Paper Pirates Possibility

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Something’s got me seriously confused. I saw a post about getting your books taken down from some pirate sites, so as a matter of interest I googled mine again, and found that not only has African Me been loaded on to heaps more torrent sites for free or paid download, but that now Shadow People has joined the pirate party as well. The thing that’s got me wondering is that they’re both being offered on ebay too as paper books. I stopped looking after four different sellers there. (Click on pics to see them bigger)

African Me Satellite TV Robinson Jo 1492719102   eBay.png1

At first I thought it could be a reader selling them second hand, but when I had a proper squiz I saw that they’re being offered as brand new/unopened. The sellers have multiple copies too – ten each mostly in stock, and they’re selling them for less than what Amazon’s charging for them.

Shadow People The Finding Robinson Jo   eBay

I looked around online and only found one small thread about paper book piracy on KB where nobody seemed to know what was going on. One person kept saying that these sellers must buy the books from Createspace and then resell them cheaply by marking up the shipping costs. This just doesn’t make sense to me. And anyway I saw where some have how many they’ve sold listed, and I know for a fact that they weren’t bought from Createspace after checking my royalties there.

I also saw a thread on some sort of black hat site suggesting that you should resell other peoples books cheaply by having them printed yourself at small cafe presses. This is absolutely doable. Small POD is all over the place these days. This guy’s suggestion wasn’t too popular on this site, but clearly the idea is out there.

sell pirated books

sell pirated books.png1

And a couple of other odd posts popped up in my google search too.

African Me   Satellite TV by Jo Robinson   Free Pdf Books

Elvis worked for the government? Who’s a drug agent? 😀

African Me   Satellite TV pdf ePub book download for free   thug s passion book download.png1

I popped back to a couple of the ebay sites and ordered a thousand copies of each of my books listed there, and the orders where accepted – I didn’t finish the sale obviously or I’d be eating turnips for a long while. I still don’t get it though. I wrote to ebay and received a very friendly response – here’s a bit:

“I cannot disclose any information on how the seller got more copies than you. Now, it is best that we take necessary to action to this and to request the removal of listings that violate intellectual property rights, you’ll need to participate in our Verified Rights Owner (VeRO) Program. To join the VeRO Program, please fill out a Notice of Claimed Infringement (NOCI) form for the listings you reported in your previous email.”

I haven’t done it yet, but I’m going to. These (top rated) sellers have millions of books listed – including some of YOURS fellow bloggers – I looked for a couple. They’re also listed as having ten brand new copies in stock and ready to ship. I don’t believe the inflating shipping costs theory, because a couple of them actually offer free shipping in their own countries, and people who regularly buy on line are probably going to know when they’re getting ripped off that way. Also I know how many paper books I’ve sold and it’s not that many.

Do any of you guys know anything about these ebay booksellers? I’m not keen on causing trouble for anyone legitimately selling my work, but I just can’t see how this is legitimate. Those torrent sites seem to exist more for the purpose of infecting the downloaders of stolen books computers with some pretty vicious malware, so I try to ignore them – but pirating paper books – if that’s what this is – is a different kettle of fish I think. Have a go at googling Your Book by You on ebay, and see what happens.

PS. Pardon the slow catching up on comments – I’ll get to them all chop chop.

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131 thoughts on “Paper Pirates Possibility

    D. Wallace Peach said:
    February 15, 2015 at 2:33 pm

    Thanks for the info and the great advice to regularly google one’s book. This info is frightening.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 15, 2015 at 2:36 pm

      It really is, and I’m sure that it’s pirating. Definitely have a squiz – I saw a couple of yours also available with ten in stock.

      Like

    philipparees said:
    February 15, 2015 at 2:51 pm

    I sympathise Jo. Having searched Ebay for ‘Involution’ I see there are 11 unauthorised sellers offering it , one for £11..00 ( List Price is £17.99). When it was first published (within a month)there were about the same number offering it cheaper than Amazon on Amazon Marketplace and when I enquired Amazon told me that they could not control people re-selling what they probably had legitimately bought. Since I had had NO sales they clearly had never bought it.(It is not a POD book) but distributed through a wholesale outlet and Bertrams.

    What then was suggested was that these dealers did not hold any stock but bought copies when they were ordered, but the figures plus shipping costs does not make any sense. I must investigate your VeRo programme for listing copyright infringement so any details you can send would be gratefully received!

    Quite honestly it is almost enough to persuade me to give up trying to sell ANY books and just undercut these bastards by giving away copies at cost myself. At least I get to make contact with real readers! Seriously worth considering.

    Liked by 2 people

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 15, 2015 at 3:02 pm

      It is disheartening Philippa, although I think that this is a new trick. I’m going to send the forms into ebay – they seem to be trying their best to stop this sort of thing. In the email I got they said that they’re trying to deal with each case one on one and the volume is huge. I’ll post on the results. In the meantime if you use the Contact Us on ebay and send them the links to where yours are listed you can get the ball rolling. Maybe if enough of us start checking on these things they’ll crack down on the sellers themselves. It’s definitely pirating – nobody would pay more for something they’re planning on selling for less. I think I might just sell my own books on ebay now too – why not – small POD here I come, and I’ll undercut the lot of the buggers. 😀

      Like

    Charles Yallowitz said:
    February 15, 2015 at 3:03 pm

    That’s new. What does it say that I’m no longer amazed by the pirating stuff that happens today? Seems to be the ‘norm’ and people think it’s sticking it to the wealthy. At least that’s the reason a few friends mentioned when I asked why they do it.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 15, 2015 at 3:08 pm

      Yours are there too btw Charles – also having stocks of at least ten. I don’t mind so much about the torrent sites, but this is seriously out of line. If you look at the happy responses, these people are selling tens of thousands of books and we’re not getting a cent. The quantity of these booksellers there is hectic, and if they’re pirating I reckon they have to be stopped or there’s no point in us trying to sell paper books at all. Just zoom on over to ebay and buy them cheaper. I reckon this is a big loss – especially for someone like you who has good and constant sales. Wealthy authors – LOLOLOL! 😀 Apart from E L James. Never mind the reviews – she’s rolling in it.

      Like

        Charles Yallowitz said:
        February 15, 2015 at 3:11 pm

        Great. I already make nothing on paperback and I’m betting they’re selling an older version too. What do I have to do to get this taken down?

        Like

          jorobinson176 responded:
          February 15, 2015 at 3:18 pm

          If you google each of your books in turn with – book name by Charles Yallowitz ebay – you’ll get the links to all the sellers selling your work, then copy and paste the links, and hit the Contact Us link on ebay. They’ll send you an email with a case number and a form to fill in to return to them. Not sure how long this has been going on but I reckon that because ebay is a legit site people will buy there instead anyway.

          Like

            Charles Yallowitz said:
            February 15, 2015 at 3:22 pm

            I’ll have to work on that. Honestly, I’m reaching the point where it feels like a fruitless battle. Every time I get one removed, another pops up. There are sites that I routinely go to and have my stuff removed. It’s like using scotch tape to fix a leaky boat. You might get some relief, but it won’t be long before it happens again.

            I guess what I’m wishing for is something that will really help instead of having to spend my morning tracking down all these damn links.

            Liked by 1 person

              jorobinson176 responded:
              February 15, 2015 at 3:47 pm

              I’m pretty sure taking these on ebay down is doable, and I reckon that what these guys are doing is more damaging to us than those torrenty guys. Some guy was openly selling pirated CD’s of every one of Terry Pratchett’s books too, although it was taken down. Already not enough hours in the day, but I’m going to google every day now, and try zap em as soon as they come up. So much for Google alerts! I haven’t got notification of any of these things from them.

              Like

                Charles Yallowitz said:
                February 15, 2015 at 3:51 pm

                I have the alerts too and it does nothing. Too bad I can’t just tell eBay the titles and they can simply eliminate them.

                Liked by 1 person

                  jorobinson176 responded:
                  February 15, 2015 at 4:11 pm

                  I reckon they’re swamped in complaints. It might be an idea to just grab one link and report that to them. I’ll definitely be following through with this, so I’ll let everyone know how it goes. I wonder if this is a massive part of why we’re not selling so many paper books.

                  Like

        Charles Yallowitz said:
        February 15, 2015 at 3:14 pm

        Has anyone tried to tell Amazon/Createspace about this since they’re losing money too? It’s obvious that they aren’t buying the books from them.

        Liked by 2 people

          jorobinson176 responded:
          February 15, 2015 at 3:19 pm

          I read on that black hat forum that Amazon aren’t interested. Also I don’t think enough authors apart from the real biggies are aware of this yet.

          Like

            Charles Yallowitz said:
            February 15, 2015 at 3:23 pm

            And the biggies probably won’t do anything because it doesn’t even dent them. There’s another site out there with everything from every author. Nobody touches them.

            Liked by 1 person

              jorobinson176 responded:
              February 15, 2015 at 3:51 pm

              Do you know the name of it Charles? The biggies also have piles of worker bees doing all this dirty work for them too. While I was watching, seeing a sale of one of my books just pop up made me crosser than I though I could get. Some arb just Made 10 bucks odd for not writing my book. Try and have a look though – have a look at how many comments they get from happy customers every day with their brand new cheap books – and that’s only the guys who respond.

              Like

                Charles Yallowitz said:
                February 15, 2015 at 3:52 pm

                I don’t remember the name off the top of my head. Why can’t the sellers be reported instead of going solely for the links?

                Like

                  jorobinson176 responded:
                  February 15, 2015 at 4:14 pm

                  I’ve been trying to think of a way. I don’t want to contact the sellers direct and just outright ask them where they’re getting their books because they’ll recognise who I am probably. I need a regular ebay user who isn’t also a writer for that. You can only report infringement of your own rights, so more than likely even if they have my books taken down, the millions of others will stay there, with their authors none the wiser.

                  Like

                    Charles Yallowitz said:
                    February 15, 2015 at 4:20 pm

                    Exactly. It also doesn’t stop them from putting them back up at a later date under a different name. That sounded a lot more doom and gloom than I expected, but I’ve seen it happen.

                    Liked by 1 person

    Pamela Beckford said:
    February 15, 2015 at 3:36 pm

    Evil people will always be around. But it stinks when they are not just stealing a widget but stealing intellectual/artistic property.

    Liked by 2 people

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 15, 2015 at 3:52 pm

      Exactly! I almost thought it was just some thing I didn’t get and walked away – glad I didn’t though. I can’t find anything much about it on the internet, so I’m pretty sure that most Indies and small presses haven’t clocked on to it yet.

      Liked by 1 person

    alienorajt said:
    February 15, 2015 at 3:37 pm

    Bloody hell, that’s seriously frightening and disheartening, Jo – thanks very much for flagging it up, though. It’s hard enough being a self-published author in the first place without effing book smugglers stealing our babies and selling them on for profit. I hope there is a special Circle in Dante’s Hell for such poor excuses for human beings. Ali xxx

    Like

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 15, 2015 at 3:44 pm

      It’s terrifying when you look at how many of them there are on ebay Ali. I’m hopeful though – ebay doesn’t want to be noticed for piracy, and if all of us who find our books being sold there that way report it to them, I think we might put a dent in it – at least as far as getting our own books taken down. The more I think about some little sod printing my books and probably making more money from them, the more I want to catch planes and go beat them a bit. At least the torrent sites mostly just give our stuff away for free, but to actually sell paper books – blood boils.

      Like

        alienorajt said:
        February 15, 2015 at 4:02 pm

        Yes, egregious in the extreme, Jo – castration is too good for these w***ers! I fear I may have to look mine up now. Not even as if I am making much from them in the first place. Makes you wonder who you can trust, doesn’t it? xx

        Like

          jorobinson176 responded:
          February 15, 2015 at 4:18 pm

          Definitely look yours up Ali. I haven’t ever been this cross about these bastards swiping my work before – this really is so smooth. The worst is seeing sales pop up as you watch the screen. I gave it time too before I checked royalties, and nada. At the end of whatever happens with my dealings with ebay, if this is really happening and not some weird alternate universe, I’m going to try and send an email to Bezos – apparently sometimes he sees them.

          Like

            alienorajt said:
            February 15, 2015 at 4:25 pm

            I have had no sales at all in the past week – and am now seriously concerned that some other bugger may be cashing in via the piratical back door. Oooh, this is making so angrier than even the direst English Department meeting during my teaching days – and I was wont to fly off the handle, and start swearing like a navvy, at most of those! xxx

            Liked by 1 person

              jorobinson176 responded:
              February 26, 2015 at 4:10 pm

              LOL! You’re right to be angry though – losing paper book sales is a really big deal. I’m just waiting for a reply from eBay now. XXXX

              Like

    philipparees said:
    February 15, 2015 at 3:38 pm

    I have just realised ( I seldom keep track on money since I make none) that Amazon are selling Involution at £6.46 so no wonder others are making money by buying and reselling under the list price. I also have looked on Ebay and find a copy of Yucatan offered at £85.92 (The book is sold at £6.99!) That is the only seller listing it! I would like to think it is so rare it has become a collector’s item, but somehow I doubt it! The book is easily available POD through CS. Nothing makes any sense

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 15, 2015 at 3:57 pm

      Some people are die hard ebay junkies, and their first go to place for anything they want. They might wander over there from Amazon looking for cheap second hand and end up finding cheap brand new instead. I bet that hundreds of your books have been sold there by now – all of our books. One thing’s for sure – I won’t ever be publishing on Smashwords again. I’ll leave the two that have already been pirated there but that’s it. I’m not keen on them offering so many formats for download. I will only ever be sending Mobi files of my new books by email too. The 85 copy of Yucatan is probably legit. 😀 Some people do like to make a profit.

      Like

    Tienny The Storyteller said:
    February 15, 2015 at 5:32 pm

    Is there a way to stop this from happening?

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:08 am

      I hope so – I’m waiting for a reply from eBay. For now we should report all of our books on offer for sale that don’t look legitimate to them I reckon.

      Like

    philipparees said:
    February 15, 2015 at 6:29 pm

    I have first written to Amazon to ask about their ridiculous pricing on Involution. THEY cannot possibly sell it at £6.43 and make a profit.( It costs that to print!) Yet if four of these EBAY sellers have each 4 in stock that means 12 books I have never heard were sold. Interested in your belief that these are pirated through smashwords eformats and especially the PDF print ready? That might make sense but Involution is not on smashwords but distributed through the ebook partnership, who uploaded to Kobo B&N etc. I think I should make them aware of this! It is almost the final coup de grace! Talk about Sisyphus.

    Like

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:17 am

      Sorry I’m so late Philippa – they’re load shedding like crazy here & between the lights going out all the time and the water going off I don’t know whether I’m coming or going. 😀 I’m pretty sure that there’s a connection to formats available and pirating – those guys will take the easiest route – although I’m sure they’ve probably figured out how to format a kindle book by now. Mark Coker has often said that piracy can’t really hurt Indies and maybe he’s right with the ebooks – but not the paper. I haven’t published Echoes with them, and so far I haven’t seen it pirated. Do you not set your book’s price yourself?

      Like

    sknicholls said:
    February 15, 2015 at 7:07 pm

    Somebody in France has one copy of my book they are selling for nearly thirty dollars with nearly twenty dollars shipping. Ha! Good luck 🙂

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:19 am

      Yikes! Hopefully that’s legit and not a testing of the water. 🙂

      Like

    teagan geneviene said:
    February 15, 2015 at 9:12 pm

    Dang-it-all, Jo. I’m sorry that’s happened. Great big hug.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:21 am

      HUGS back! Thank you my lovely Teagan. It’s a good learning curve, that’s for sure. Hopefully ebay will take them down, and also, I’ll be very careful who I send different format books to in future – best to stick to mobi I reckon. X

      Liked by 1 person

        teagan geneviene said:
        February 27, 2015 at 3:02 am

        It’s one good thing (i guess the only one) about not selling many books — the pirates aren’t interested in mine! 😀

        Liked by 1 person

          jorobinson176 responded:
          February 27, 2015 at 4:36 am

          They’ll grab it if the can I’m sure. Is yours on Smashwords by the way?

          Like

    Smorgasbord - Variety is the Spice of Life. said:
    February 15, 2015 at 9:24 pm

    I will check on mine Jo.. I know that in the past with my print books on non Amazon sites, David has gone into order and they have said they do not have any copies in stock but have others that cover the same subject! So in some cases it is a shotgun approach – they take all listings on Amazon, claim to have the books in stock and then turn around and offer you something else. We hold the only books in stock for all my printed copies since we post them out when Amazon makes a sale.. this means we have a record of who they have been sold to.. Unfortunately with Ebooks once they are out there they are so easy to copy..Your solution of all writers swamping Ebay with complaints is a good one but perhaps we should think about setting up a naming and shaming site.. Each author lists their books and the only official sites that they are sold on when new… used copies it is difficult to police but if they are claiming to sell new copies then they are obviously pirated.
    Whilst you may for legal reasons not be able to say outright that Jo Bloggs is pirating books you can infer that if one of your books is offered on any but your official sites new then they are pirated copies. Thanks for the heads up and yes makes your blood boil.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:23 am

      That’s a great idea Sal! The naming and shaming. Where do you reckon we should post? There’s already enough of us with books there, and I’m sure that there are loads more too.

      Like

    Smorgasbord - Variety is the Spice of Life. said:
    February 15, 2015 at 10:03 pm

    I have just my first book Just Food for Health listed with 7 sellers who all have 2 copies.. firstly I believe because the descriptions are identical that it is the same seller but with different front ends.. Secondly, I did sell quite a few in that year – but also gave away copies to my clients to use as work books. However, that means that they are unlikely to be as claimed pristine,new and unread.. However, we also had a thought about before the sales process.. Print runs if a well managed works will be pretty exact but I would like to find out about overruns and just how many books might have been printed outside of the original order and what happens to them..I have no wish to cast suspicion on anyone but it seems to be that would be a source of five, ten or even 20 books that might have been produced in error say.. If you had an arrangement with an online seller to pass all those books on at a discount that over a year – even at cost of print that would be quite a few books available that we have no knowledge about…and never get paid for.. I am sure that someone in the POD business will come back and tell me I am wrong but it would seem a plausible answer.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:28 am

      With the POD you have a record of every book as it sells come up on your dashboard, and I’m pretty sure that them selling overruns of Indie books without paying the author would be breach of contract. Good point though. I’m going to contact ebay again on Monday if I haven’t heard from them yet.

      Like

    Nancy said:
    February 16, 2015 at 12:59 am

    Reblogged this on "OUR WORLD".

    Liked by 1 person

    Cate Russell-Cole said:
    February 16, 2015 at 1:25 am

    Oh dear god, no. 😦

    Liked by 1 person

    mellizwarren said:
    February 16, 2015 at 1:28 am

    I work for a book distributor. Print books – most internet \marketplace’ sellers hold no stock at all – they just list every book on the planet in the hope of making a sale. Their listing comes from Nielsen Bookdata (although this has a large cost attached) or it is just linked to the description on Amazon, hence the fact that descriptions are identical. Saying the book is ‘in stock’ often means it is in stock with their supplier i.e. a wholesaler. Large/successful sellers will be able to negotiate drop-shipping with their supplier/wholesaler, so can promise delivery in a day; smaller ones may not so will quote longer shipping times, to enable them to order the book in question and repack it for sending to their customer. Prices – are usually calculated by software which automatically undercuts Amazon prices. The sellers will have a discount from their supplier of 35-50%, so this is why they sometimes add charges to the shipping cost because they do have to make a profit somehow. Some are ruthless, I admit, but most are reasonable.

    I have no knowledge of ebooks but it would seem to me entirely logical that ebooks would be relatively easy to pirate (although I have no idea how this might be done) but printed books seen for sale online are usually legitimate.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:32 am

      This makes a lot of sense. The thing that bothers me is that I saw sales of my book marked as copies sold on a couple of the ebay sites, with no corresponding royalties paid to me, and mine are only available from Createspace. Do you know if this happens with them as well?

      Like

    theowllady said:
    February 16, 2015 at 4:11 am

    Reblogged this on theowlladyblog.

    Liked by 1 person

    Michelle Rene Goodhew said:
    February 16, 2015 at 5:28 am

    Reblogged this on Custom Cover Design by Michelle Rene and commented:
    Authors Beware

    Liked by 1 person

    T Ibara Photo said:
    February 16, 2015 at 2:34 pm

    This is so sad and upsetting 😦 😦

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:35 am

      It really is Takami. I suppose that it’s the way of things with such clever computer thieves around these days. X

      Like

    Hugh's Views and News said:
    February 16, 2015 at 6:00 pm

    I’ve been done out of money a few times on eBay, Jo, and always report the seller to eBay. Also, I always pay by PayPal because that way the buyer is always protected if what he/she receives is not a genuine item. I suppose it’s like buying counterfeit goods and, even when buying online, I would always recommend reporting it to Trading Standards as well, if the seller resides in the same country. Trading Standards may be known by a different name in other countries but they are usually the department who seize counterfeit or dangerous items on offer for sale to the public.

    I’m pleased to hear eBay are being helpful but it’s such a shame forms have to completed to stop the seller. It recently happened to a blog I follow here on WordPress where all her posts were being duplicated by another blogger who was taking full credit for all her work. WordPress were very helpful but she still had to complete quite a few forms to get the offending blog taken offline by WordPress (which took a few days to do). She recommended her followers to google their own posts just to check that nobody else was duplicating their work anywhere else online. Fortunately, my google results returned the results I wanted but it was certainly a check worth doing just to check that nobody else was taking the credit for my hard work.

    I hope you manage to get this horrible discovery sorted out very soon.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:42 am

      Thanks Hugh – I think that Trading Standards is definitely worth a shot. Even if there is some way that this isn’t copyright infringement, I would think that as Indies, we get to say who sells our new books and for how much. There’s no point in the whole thing if readers can pick up brand new books on ebay for less than mine cost on Amazon.

      I haven’t googled my blog posts yet – doubt that anyone would want to pinch most of my loony words. I’ll have a squiz for sure now though. It’s disgusting that someone would take credit for some lazy sod to take credit for your blogger friend’s work! I have seen this before a couple of times too – blatant copy and paste jobs of wonderful inspiring blogs and then basking in the undeserved glory. Nasty buggers.

      Liked by 1 person

    Elle Knowles said:
    February 18, 2015 at 2:48 pm

    Reblogged this on Finding Myself Through Writing and commented:
    Is your book selling on ebay or other sites without your consent? I couldn’t believe it when I checked and found ‘Crossing The Line’ on ebay! Here’s an interesting article from Jo Robinson to get you questioning the possibility of whether your book is out there being sold illegally! Thanks Jo for all this information! ~Elle

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:43 am

      Thanks for sharing Elle. 🙂 I’m hoping that this is properly sorted by ebay quickly & will add an update with what happens.

      Liked by 1 person

    […] finally… This weekend Jo Robinson drew attention to the piracy of her books, and we found that Amazon was selling the print copy of […]

    Liked by 1 person

    julz said:
    February 19, 2015 at 8:28 am

    WOW – what a mess!
    seems to me that self publishing has gone back a couple of decades – then it was almost impossible to get a shop to stock them and you made no money – now its impossible to stop others selling them – and you still get no money!

    Its a real shame – no I’m not an author – might be someday – but reading this puts me off – mightily!

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:47 am

      We’ll have to find a way around the thieves Julz. Don’t be put off though – I think that maybe if we’re vigilant and check now and then, we can stop most of the pirates. Big sites like ebay especially won’t want anything illegal going on, so with them involved now we’ll hopefully be able to stop these at least.

      Liked by 1 person

    chrllrobb.blog said:
    February 20, 2015 at 6:37 am

    So sorry to hear this Jo. It is really disgusting when people who have a smart brain, cannot use it for good instead of greed and ignorance. I hope you can get it all straightened out with ebay.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:49 am

      Exactly! These pirates are pretty clever. I’ve seen a couple of their chats with each other on line – they often seem to think that they’re doing some sort of public service – stealing from the rich to give to the poor, like modern Robin Hoods – rich authors – LOLOL! X

      Liked by 1 person

        chrllrobb.blog said:
        February 27, 2015 at 5:36 am

        More like lining their pockets! I will not be ordering any books from Ebay. I’d rather go through an authorized book site, or direct from the author. Thank you for the heads up on this. I have been kind of glad and surprised to see some books I wanted on Ebay. Now I know why some of them were.

        Like

    cicampbell2013 said:
    February 21, 2015 at 4:13 pm

    Oh my giddy aunt! I’m shocked at how widespread piracy is. It’s despicable!
    Had a look, and yes, I do believe I’m a victim too, though not on a grand scale, as far as I’ve discovered so far. I’ve only taken a cursory glance because I had planned to be working on my next novel today and I really don’t need to become too disheartened.
    I’m sorry, Jo, that you seem to have lost out big time through the selfishness and greed of these individuals. We really ought to find another name for them. Pirate sounds far too romantic: the stuff of fairy stories and adventure films.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:53 am

      My giddy aunt! Love that sentence! 😀 It really is despicable Christine. There are loads of ways that these guys can print and sell our books without getting easily spotted on line too. We can’t become disheartened though – maybe just be careful to only send ebooks other than mobi format to people that we know. I’m sure we’ll be fine in the end of it all – thieves or not – you’re right pirate sounds far too romantic for them. X

      Like

    cicampbell2013 said:
    February 21, 2015 at 5:05 pm

    Reblogged this on cicampbellblog and commented:
    What comes to your mind when you think of pirates? Captain Hook with his mishmash of misfits and lovable rogues? Johnny Depp in swashbuckling form on the Caribbean? Or perhaps you no longer see them as storybook characters or romantic film stars, but as the robbers and murderers, the literal breed that sail the seas. Or even the highjackers of other people’s intellectual and artistic property.
    This article by fellow author and blogger Jo Robinson, highlights the last category. Those who feel no compunction when stealing from singer, artist, actor or author.
    When reading this article, please do keep in mind that the theft is real.
    As an indie author myself, I know how much time, effort, pain and toil go into writing a novel. There is also financial expenditure. Even if you don’t have to pay for publication, you are recommended to hire a professional editor, proofreader, and cover designer. Then buy some of your own books to give reviewers and media outlets in order to gain some promotion for your book. Being a writer does not come cheap.
    Most paperback novels cost little more than the price of a half-decent cup of coffee and a cookie. Ebooks cost far less.
    How much of that does the author see? Depending which publisher, which distributor, which bookstore — very, very little.
    And now the pirates are taking over the marketplace.
    Look, they are swinging in on their long, trailing vines of dot coms and dot cos. Hiding in the internet swamps, reaching out with long tentacle arms to lure the unwary into buying their wares, their STOLEN goods.
    So please, being a writer is already becoming a very expensive hobby for independent authors, please let them see a little reward for their hard work. Please help them recoup a little of their outlay.
    Please buy only from approved bookseller sites, places where you know the author has placed their book for your reading pleasure, without their piracy pain.

    Liked by 2 people

    Bette A. Stevens said:
    February 21, 2015 at 7:20 pm

    Hi Jo. Shared this post. I set up Google Alerts for my books and found something strange yesterday. Two of my books are advertised under another author on a strange site. Not sure what to do about it. I’ll have to investigate. Sharing this post. Thank you.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:56 am

      Thanks for sharing Bette! Wow! If another author is claiming to have written your books that’s downright plagiarism! Any news on findings yet?

      Like

    The Story Reading Ape said:
    February 21, 2015 at 9:43 pm

    Reblogged this on Chris The Story Reading Ape's Blog and commented:
    AUTHORS – YOU REALLY need to read / reblog / share everywhere and act as advised in this article by Author Jo Robinson…

    Liked by 1 person

    Let's CUT the Crap! said:
    February 21, 2015 at 10:21 pm

    Reblogged this on How the Cookie Crumbles and commented:
    Pirating is alive and well. Beware.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 2:57 am

      Thanks for sharing Tess! 🙂

      Like

        Let's CUT the Crap! said:
        February 27, 2015 at 4:35 am

        Another friend who has a book up at Amazon (hasn’t had time to sell even one copy) told me (after re-blog of this post) she found three copies of her book on eBay. How does this happen? How do these ‘people’ get contents of anyone’s book? She hasn’t even sole one copy YET!

        Liked by 1 person

          jorobinson176 responded:
          February 27, 2015 at 4:40 am

          Exactly Tess! On the surface these sites look innocuous if you think that they’ll order books from the author’s Amazon site, but they’re not, and they’re still selling the books. Smashwords offers all sorts of downloads – PDF is pretty much print ready for cafe presses. Also when we do ebook giveaways we tend to send the preferred format to the winners, so there are loads of easy to print or steal digitally books floating around.

          Like

            Let's CUT the Crap! said:
            February 27, 2015 at 8:40 pm

            There m.u.s.t. be a safeguard somewhere, somehow. Hope a solution is found soon. Maybe the solution resides somewhere with the PDF print ready files. 😦

            Like

    Let's CUT the Crap! said:
    February 21, 2015 at 10:34 pm

    A blogging friend mentioned someone she knows recently found herself in this same predicament.
    I hope this mystery will be resolved to your benefit.

    Reblogged this at http://letscutthecrap.wordpress.com
    Piracy is alive and well.

    Liked by 2 people

    jcckeith said:
    February 22, 2015 at 12:07 am

    Reblogged this on Jcckeith.

    Liked by 1 person

    danniehill said:
    February 22, 2015 at 12:36 am

    Thank you, Jo. Isn’t it terrible that some people will steal anything without regard they are hurting independent artist. Taking food out of our mouths.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:00 am

      It’s especially gutting to see them register sales when you know that they’re not earning you a cent. Much worse than them offering them for free download somehow. X

      Like

    danniehill said:
    February 22, 2015 at 12:50 am

    Just checked Ebay and all of my books are there. Makes me want to boycott Ebay and start blogging about there methods of operation. Thanks again for the info.

    Liked by 2 people

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:02 am

      Sorry Dannie! If you contact them they’ll send you a form to fill in – they seem to be keen to nip any pirating in the bud.

      Like

    J.B. Whitmore said:
    February 22, 2015 at 2:48 am

    Visiting from CuttheCrap blog. Man, how creepy is this? First music, now books. As if it isn’t bogdacious enough that writers are doing the platform building for themselves. Hope you get some remedy. Thanks for the heads up.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:05 am

      Thanks to you! The music industry is scary – I read somewhere that musicians are losing big time, apart from live shows. I hope we don’t end up the same way – I’m sure we’ll find a way to fix the paper book problem though, even though the ebooks are much harder to stop.

      Liked by 1 person

    Susanne Leist said:
    February 22, 2015 at 4:42 am

    Earlier this week, before I read your article, I had Googled myself. I found that a site called Geneplay.net was offering free downloads of my book. I called them and they told me that they didn’t have my book. I told them that I had contacted FBI Cyber Crime, which I did. Some authors have suggested that I file a cease and desist order on them. I haven’t done that yet. My book is not a big best seller, so I can’t figure out why they’re offering my book. Susanne Leist

    Liked by 2 people

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:09 am

      I reckon that the more we try and stop all of this the better Susanne. A lot of people like Mark Coker have said that piracy is good to get you noticed, and so many books have been sent out for free in all sorts of formats these past years. Lots of people want everything for free these days and even if we aren’t giving our books away, someone else is. I was wondering the other day what would happen if all of a sudden there was no way of getting a free book – people would have to buy or go without – I reckon that would definitely have an impact on our sales. Talk about wishful thinking! 🙂

      Liked by 1 person

    Jennifer T Webb said:
    February 22, 2015 at 6:03 am

    This is shocking! Thanks for the info…scary monsters under the bed! Glad Ebay said they’d work with you.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:12 am

      Definitely scared the heck out of me. They’re definitely very interested in stopping intellectual copyright infringement, so I’m hoping that there are lots more writers reporting their books too. Those book sellers are making a LOT of money from books they haven’t written.

      Liked by 1 person

        Jennifer T Webb said:
        February 27, 2015 at 3:19 pm

        Absolutely ridiculous that it is so prevalent based on what you found. This affects us all and yes, the gazillions that are yours are totally being stolen.
        My next step is printing but this has made me consider not doing it until there is a way to cover oneself from this thievery. It is wrong on all levels.
        One thought I had was about copyrighting each page or something to that effect, that would make it difficult for someone to print it without expense or huge amounts of work.
        Please keep us informed of the steps you are taking and I do so hope justice will be served.

        Like

    Connie Flanagan said:
    February 22, 2015 at 6:54 am

    Have any of you set up the title of your book or your name in Google Alerts? If you don’t know how, there is a helpful post on http://writerswin.com/using-google-alerts-build-author-connections/. (It also explains how to use Google Alerts to Build Your Author Connections, but the instructions on how to set up Google Alert terms are there as well.)

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:13 am

      Thanks Connie! I set mine up a while ago, and very occasionally I get a notice, although none of these popped up.

      Liked by 1 person

        Connie Flanagan said:
        February 28, 2015 at 4:23 am

        If you are using your title and it contains more than one word, be certain to use quotation marks around it. e.g., “Running Amok” as opposed to just Running Amok. The second will give you results for “running” and for “amok.”

        Like

    Zoe Ambler said:
    February 22, 2015 at 9:24 pm

    Reblogged this on Zoe Ambler – Author.

    Liked by 1 person

    noelleg44 said:
    February 22, 2015 at 11:09 pm

    Dear God in heaven, one more thing we have to worry about. I’m off to look up my book.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:15 am

      They never give up this lot of book swipers. I wonder if they’ve targeted audio books yet.

      Like

    Courtney M. Wendleton said:
    February 22, 2015 at 11:30 pm

    Reblogged this on Books and More.

    Liked by 1 person

    lornot13 said:
    February 23, 2015 at 2:45 am

    I found my book on eBay as well. It says they have three copies. Interesting… my book is self-published and I only have it on Amazon/Kindle. I haven’t sold any copies yet. So where did these “three copies” come from?

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:17 am

      Exactly what I don’t understand. If they were buying the books legitimately we Indies would know. Writers with small or big presses don’t have that info, but every sale of every paper book should pay us royalties.

      Like

    Kate Loveton said:
    February 23, 2015 at 3:30 am

    This is dreadful. It never would have occurred to me.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:18 am

      I almost brushed it off as legit, but I don’t see how it can be.

      Like

    mgill0627 said:
    February 23, 2015 at 8:05 am

    I’m a little confused here (nothing new for me.) I looked up my book on e-bay, it says they are for sale at 12.50. I have my POD books set up on Ingram Spark with a list price of 8.99, Resellers get a 55% discount on the book, so they pay about 4.45 per copy. If they want to sell it for 12:50, and someone is willing to pay that. I’m fine. I dont know how many copies they have. I doubt they have even one physically in their posession. I just figured if they get an order, they place a 3rd party shipment request through Ingram and have it shipped directly to the customer. This sounds okay to me.

    Am I just being stupid?

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:22 am

      That sounds legitimate if they’re buying through Ingram Spark or haven’t ordered yet. The thing that got me was the actual sales noted on the sites of my particular books, but those sales not registering on Createspace – not sure where they got paper copies of my lot that they sold, but it couldn’t have been legitimately.

      Like

    Tracy Campbell said:
    February 24, 2015 at 11:23 pm

    So sorry to hear your book is being pirated, Jo. Thank for sharing this important info.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:22 am

      Thank you Tracy. Hopefully we’ll get to the bottom of it, one way or another.

      Like

    Leona said:
    February 25, 2015 at 12:14 pm

    Reblogged this on Leona's Blog of Shadows and commented:
    Author Jo Robins warns us about a new form of book piracy in her eye opening blog post. I was seriously disturbed to read this , apparently the intellectual property thieves don’t just pirate the ebooks but paper books too. They print the hard copies at cheap small cafe presses and sell them cheaper than the Amazon price by marking up the shipping cost. Some of them offer free shipping, perhaps they use small presses in poor countries to cut down the costs or use very low quality recycled paper, I really have no idea.

    What’s certain is they are pirating indie books left, and and center and this dirty theft is done by some top rated power sellers on ebay who sell MILLIONS of books. Jo reports that she has seen indie books in their listings. You need to stay vigilant and report the copyright infringements to Ebay immediately. Ebay recommends you’ll need to participate in their Verified Rights Owner (VeRO) Program. To join the VeRO Program, you will need to fill out a Notice of Claimed Infringement (NOCI) form for the listings of your books you find and report for copyright violation. Ebay will remove those listings and the sellers will hopefully take a hit and learn better.

    Author and blogger friends please help me inform the community by spreading this post far and wide. Indie authors are not rich people, many of us are struggling to make ends meet and it’s extremely disturbing that the pirates are selling more of our books than we do, imagine you sell 10 copies on Amazon but the pirates sell hundreds of your books and pocketing the money while you are struggling out there. It’s hurting both your revenues and your Amazon ranking. Let’s spread the word and inform all indie authors we know.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:24 am

      Thanks for sharing this Leona! Thanks also for explainging the VeRO Program – we all really do need to join it.

      Like

    gentlekindness said:
    February 25, 2015 at 1:37 pm

    very helpful information. Very disturbing that people have no conscience.
    Annie

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:25 am

      Thank you Annie. There really are some very hard people out there. X

      Like

    Gayle Mullen Pace said:
    February 25, 2015 at 2:25 pm

    Reblogged this on Gayle Mullen Pace ~ Author and commented:
    While I haven’t found any of my books on eBay, I HAVE found them elsewhere. I notify them of copyright infringement, they take it down, and a few months later, it’s back. Folks, this problem is here to stay and it’s up to us to remain vigilant. Let’s do all we can to take care of our intellectual property, and if we find another author’s work in a suspicious place, let them know about it. We’re all in this boat together.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:27 am

      Thanks for sharing Gayle. You’re so right – we have to be vigilant, and we are all in this together. Maybe a massive group of irate Indies can make enough dents in pirate sites to make a difference.

      Like

    Gayle Mullen Pace said:
    February 25, 2015 at 2:26 pm

    I have reblogged this. Thank you for alerting us.

    Liked by 1 person

    Sally Ember, Ed.D. said:
    February 25, 2015 at 4:36 pm

    Reblogged this on Sally Ember, Ed.D. and commented:
    #Bookpirating info especially regarding print copies printed and sold on #eBay

    Liked by 1 person

    Suzanne Joshi said:
    February 26, 2015 at 5:10 pm

    Thanks, Jo, for this helpful information.

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      February 27, 2015 at 3:29 am

      Pleasure Suzanne – hopefully we can nip it in the bud. 🙂

      Like

    Jennifer T Webb said:
    February 27, 2015 at 3:28 pm

    Reblogged this on 'The Last Wave: A Near-Death Experience' and commented:
    To all authors with printed books or future compilations, this is the most serious thing happening in our writer’s world. We need a solution. This author found this out, First Hand: “These (top rated) sellers have millions of books listed – including some of YOURS fellow bloggers – I looked for a couple. They’re also listed as having ten brand new copies in stock and ready to ship.” Jo Robinson

    Like

    hitandrun1964 said:
    March 5, 2015 at 6:14 pm

    Just one more terrible thing that people are doing to each other. Thank you for bring this to my attention, I had no idea.

    Like

    dr sweetyshinde said:
    March 17, 2015 at 7:18 pm

    Not pirates – these people should be termed ‘parasites’. They live on another’s creativity. Sick!

    Liked by 1 person

    Flossie Stewart, Author said:
    May 16, 2015 at 6:15 am

    I have 2 and they are both on ebay, for nearly twice what I have them listed for. I am very upset, and I will be taking this advice and sharing with my FB writers’ group friends. It makes me very angry that these people are making all this money off of my books, while I have made nothing off of these “sales”. I have been on here for an hour trying to figure out what is going on. Now I know. Thank you for sharing this. You are right, we are in this together. What really burns me up is, I am struggling to make it as a writer, and my husband is on the kidney transplant list, and our family is struggling to raise funds for his kidney transplant expense fund, while these thieves are making all this money off my hard work. They will be hearing from me!

    Liked by 1 person

      jorobinson176 responded:
      May 17, 2015 at 11:05 am

      Hi Flossie! You’re right – these thieves are taking food off our tables from our hard work. It’s hard to stop them too when it comes to eBooks, but this is doable because eBay doesn’t want pirates there either. Good luck with pounding the swine!

      Like

    Flossie Stewart, Author said:
    May 16, 2015 at 6:48 am

    Reblogged this on Flossie Stewart, Author and commented:
    #BookPirating Print copies of your books being sold on #ebay,
    For my fellow authors who follow me, my readers who support me, all I will say is, thank you for your support, we are working together, and we are #authorshelpingauthors! To those who are in on this shameful scheme to make money off of other authors’ hard work, we ARE on to you and we will work together to protect our work and help each other! We are united!

    Liked by 1 person

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